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FlyingCamel
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PostPosted: Sat Sep 17, 2005 10:02 pm
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cat-chaz wrote:
In my opinion the Man Show was a ridiculously sexist comedy (and i felt it was almost as degrading to men as it was to women, sexism hurts men, too).


I just had to say I think it might have actually been more degrading to men. Laughing
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PostPosted: Sat Sep 17, 2005 10:07 pm
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Grimlock wrote:
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Not enough for me. Parenthesis remind me of boobs. Laughing
could you stop talking about boobs! that's totally juvenile and it really offends me!!! ewwww! we should pass a law against them. We must protect the sanctity of women and should never talk bad about them. Stop those evil heathens. stop activist judges. Ban Boobs! Boobs should not be allowed to marry.

Good point. Only mustaches and fuckable voices should be legal.
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PostPosted: Sat Sep 17, 2005 10:09 pm
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FlyingCamel wrote:
cat-chaz wrote:
In my opinion the Man Show was a ridiculously sexist comedy (and i felt it was almost as degrading to men as it was to women, sexism hurts men, too).


I just had to say I think it might have actually been more degrading to men. Laughing

It totally was. That's why I can't understand why anyone would have a serious stance on that show. It painted men to be total idiots that only followed their hard-ons while the women they found attractive ruled their world.
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Grimlock
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PostPosted: Sat Sep 17, 2005 10:13 pm
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FlyingCamel wrote:
cat-chaz wrote:
In my opinion the Man Show was a ridiculously sexist comedy (and i felt it was almost as degrading to men as it was to women, sexism hurts men, too).


I just had to say I think it might have actually been more degrading to men. Laughing
I totally agree with this too. Everytime I see girls in bikinis with 34DD's bouncing on trampolines a little piece of my manhood dies. I feel so much shame and denigration not to mention a tingling sensation. stop the madness.
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FlyingCamel
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PostPosted: Sat Sep 17, 2005 10:28 pm
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I just looked at the pic and zoomed in to read the captions--cool! Jenny's wearing her own clothes! That's funny that the rest of them aren't. Jenny has such fashion sense. hhahaha...*raids her closet*

She must have the coolest closet ever.
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PostPosted: Sat Sep 17, 2005 10:48 pm
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Built To Post wrote:
cat-chaz wrote:

And i'm not saying anyone has to agree with that assessment/judgment.

so to bring it back to Maxim, i just personally have no use for Maxim, Kimmel, Corolla, whatever or whoever, and i give them absolutely ZERO credit for making money off of women's sexuality, that's what pimps do.

but as i said in my original post, (and in the Liz Phair thread, and countless other times) i have no problem with women or bands using their own sexuality, or sexuality based outlets like Maxim to make money.


You just called Maxim a sexist magazine and compared it to being pretty much the same as sexist comedies such as The Man Show. The juggies are on a sexist show. Jenny is the sexist magazine Maxim. Does Jenny not now have a brain, or are you taking this thing too serious?

I think that you are not giving people enough credit. The juggies were smart enough for knowing what they were doing, RK was smart enough to know what they were doing, and it's a small percentage of people who don't realize their calculations or sense of humor.


are you one of the many who is not reading my posts anymore? because nearly everything you said was flatly contradicted by my PREVIOUS post. I said REPEATEDLY that whatever RK does is fine with me, and that I understand completely why women who live in a society that values their bodies over everything else they have to offer would make the decision to use sexuality.

The remark that i'm implying Jenny doesn't have a brain is totally unfair, and is completely contradicted by my posts. Come on man, disagree with me but don't accuse me of things i not only didn't say, but of things I said the exact opposite of.

that doesn't change my view, MY OPINION, that yes, Maxim is sexist, the Man Show was sexist. It is ridiculous to state that just because women like the juggies make a decision to do be on a show that means the show isn't sexist. Women in a sexist society are forced to make difficult choices, and I don't blame them for those choices, but it is absolutely freaking absurd to say their choices absolve the men in charge of their sexism.

I do take sexism seriously, whatever the genre it appears, but i
was just making a joke about Corolla, Kimmel, and Maxim. I swear i didn't have any idea that saying the man show and Maxim were sexist would be controversial, seems like pretty obvious stuff TO ME.
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Grimlock
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PostPosted: Sat Sep 17, 2005 11:08 pm
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cat chaz, I think you are patronizing women with your " Women in a sexist society are forced to make difficult choices" which is sexist in itself if you think about it. I mean you, a Man defending Women's rights cause they can't defend themselves sounds sexist right? They can fight their own battles. I live in manhattan. women here don't take any guff. In fact they are pretty much on top of the food chain. My sisters and girlfriend, and friends who are women also always try to steal my maxims every chance they get. I asked my sister once "why are you taking that? it's a guys mag." she replied "cause it's funny and a lot better than vogue and marie claire". you wanna see sexist? read elle, us weekly, or any women's mag and look at their perceptions on how women should be.
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waking in winter
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PostPosted: Sat Sep 17, 2005 11:16 pm
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I feel so bad for your girlfriend. I'll take cat-chaz's shtick anyday over your continual objectification of women. Lose the Jenny avatar, and show some fucking respect that you see her as more than an object. I refuse to believe that I'm the only one here who reads your posts and and wants to smack some fucking sense into you.
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Grimlock
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PostPosted: Sat Sep 17, 2005 11:23 pm
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boob nazi. why do you continually try to persecute a person because of his sexual preference?
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PostPosted: Sat Sep 17, 2005 11:24 pm
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cat-chaz wrote:
are you one of the many who is not reading my posts anymore? because nearly everything you said was flatly contradicted by my PREVIOUS post. I said REPEATEDLY that whatever RK does is fine with me, and that I understand completely why women who live in a society that values their bodies over everything else they have to offer would make the decision to use sexuality.

You're right. I'm drunk. I didn't completely read your post. I apologize for being a dick. It will happen again. I'm like that. Just tell me that I'm being a drunk asshole in the future.

I don't think that women using their sexuality in this time is anything different than what has occurred through time. People as a whole use their strengths to achieve their goals.

cat-chaz wrote:
The remark that i'm implying Jenny doesn't have a brain is totally unfair, and is completely contradicted by my posts. Come on man, disagree with me but don't accuse me of things i not only didn't say, but of things I said the exact opposite of.

that doesn't change my view, MY OPINION, that yes, Maxim is sexist, the Man Show was sexist. It is ridiculous to state that just because women like the juggies make a decision to do be on a show that means the show isn't sexist. Women in a sexist society are forced to make difficult choices, and I don't blame them for those choices, but it is absolutely freaking absurd to say their choices absolve the men in charge of their sexism.

The Man Show made men look a lot more stupid and foolish than women. I don't think that anyone changed their basic outlook on life based on that show.

cat-chaz wrote:
I do take sexism seriously, whatever the genre it appears, but i
was just making a joke about Corolla, Kimmel, and Maxim. I swear i didn't have any idea that saying the man show and Maxim were sexist would be controversial, seems like pretty obvious stuff TO ME.

See, this is where I disagree with you for the most part. You are trying to make it like The Man Show was sexist. If so, for which sex? They made total asses out men week in and week out. To me sexism was never a part of the show because they ridiculed both sides. It was a comedy show, not a statement.
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Grimlock
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PostPosted: Sat Sep 17, 2005 11:28 pm
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waking in winter wrote:
I feel so bad for your girlfriend. I'll take cat-chaz's shtick anyday over your continual objectification of women. Lose the Jenny avatar, and show some fucking respect that you see her as more than an object. I refuse to believe that I'm the only one here who reads your posts and and wants to smack some fucking sense into you.
hey I changed my avatar to Blake sennet's boobs. What's the difference? Isn't this why we escaped the imperialism of England? to get away fromt the sexual persecution. such hypocrites. I find this sociology lesson pretty interesting.
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PostPosted: Sat Sep 17, 2005 11:30 pm
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waking in winter wrote:
show some fucking respect that you see her as more than an object.

We all see celebrities and band members as objects. How we see them is different though. What is wrong with him finding her attractive to go along with her beautiful voice?

Is there not a million posts here about how sexy they think the male members of the band are? Let's not make a double standard.
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Grimlock
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PostPosted: Sat Sep 17, 2005 11:32 pm
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exactly my point dude. tinted glasses. and you know what's funny? I work for estee lauder which is the biggest makeup company in the world. They employ 70 percent women, 29 percent gay guys and 1 percent which is me. I show my coworkers your posts and they are laughing there asses off. My bosses are women, My bosses, bosses are women. My friends are queer and I have to look at my screen saying I'm a sexist asshole who objectifies women. Grow up. Stop reading the new york times or whatever internet site you get your sense of morality from and join reality.
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Last edited by Grimlock on Sat Sep 17, 2005 11:47 pm; edited 2 times in total
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PostPosted: Sat Sep 17, 2005 11:42 pm
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Grimlock wrote:
My friends are queer

The wording of that isn't going to play over well here. Laughing
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waking in winter
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PostPosted: Sat Sep 17, 2005 11:43 pm
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Built To Post wrote:
waking in winter wrote:
show some fucking respect that you see her as more than an object.

We all see celebrities and band members as objects. How we see them is different though. What is wrong with him finding her attractive to go along with her beautiful voice?

Is there not a million posts here about how sexy they think the male members of the band are? Let's not make a double standard.


There's a point where a compliment degrades into something rude and weird. It's one thing to say, "Jenny looks good in that picture" and a whole other to have a paragraph about how big her boobs are. I happen to think they are all very good looking people, but if they were ugly it wouldn't change how I feel about them at all. Maybe I'm hypersensitive about this, but if I were Jenny, I wouldn't find it flattering. I'd be creeped out and disgusted, and I think most of the women on the board would agree with me.
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Grimlock
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PostPosted: Sat Sep 17, 2005 11:48 pm
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and waking in winter one more thing. I find it really weird that your sig comes from Conan O'brien. Have you watched that show? have you seen the jokes he's said about women? The skits he's done about them? for example: in a skit about, coincidentally, a commencement speech he gives to an all female university he tells them that they should all get breast implants! and he goes "BBBahhhBIG BBBOoooBIIES!" and gives a perverted wolf face. and this is totally true. You can ask anybody about this skit. A little indignant aren't we.
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Grimlock
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PostPosted: Sat Sep 17, 2005 11:54 pm
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waking in winter wrote:
There's a point where a compliment degrades into something rude and weird.
like how fuckable jenny's voice is? where is your high and mightiness on that board? the reason is cause you are prejuidice against guys who admire boobs instead of guys who want to stick their dicks in a persons melody box.
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PostPosted: Sat Sep 17, 2005 11:54 pm
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waking in winter wrote:
Maybe I'm hypersensitive about this, but if I were Jenny, I wouldn't find it flattering. I'd be creeped out and disgusted, and I think most of the women on the board would agree with me.

It would be creepy, and I think is the kind of stuff she has seen and been irked by. BUT, when you agree to be in a magazine - especially a men's magazine like Maxim - wearing such a body hugging, low cut outfit...well, what do you expect?
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PostPosted: Sun Sep 18, 2005 1:50 am
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Jenny won't lose a moment of sleep because straight males find her attractive.

Do any of you honestly feel that Jenny is concerned that men buy her albums because her voice is fuckable?
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PostPosted: Sun Sep 18, 2005 3:24 am
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i dont think jenny would be disgusted because someone appreciates her breasts, i think she would be disgusted because someone is pathetic enough to go on for an entire paragraph about how great they are. that is where it gets creepy. [and like i said, pathetic.]

yes, she has boobs. yes, theyre pretty big. fantastic, lets move on.

your post was immature and unnecessary. all you had to say to get your point across was "jenny looks beautiful/great/amazing/hot/whatever." and "wow she has nice boobs" or whatever. i'm a girl, and i'll admit i've commented on them before. but you went on far too long about her body, it was just silly.

look, you wouldnt walk up to her and say that to her face, right? and why not? probably the same reasons we're telling you it was inappropriate to say it here.
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oh, it's max.
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PostPosted: Sun Sep 18, 2005 7:58 am
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grimlock is awesome. i love you grimlock.
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PostPosted: Sun Sep 18, 2005 10:33 am
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Whatever the rights and wrongs of individual points of view, from the outside looking in, I have to say that this has been a genuinely fascinating debate.

Just one point though; if you think the American War of Independence had anything to do with the emancipation of women or any other form of sexual freedom then you have a pretty warped view of history. Like all wars it was about power, autonomy and, most importantly, money (well taxes anyway). Quite rightly too I must add. Well done there the USA.
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PostPosted: Sun Sep 18, 2005 11:43 am
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zenitram wrote:
i think she would be disgusted because someone is pathetic enough to go on for an entire paragraph about how great they are. that is where it gets creepy. [and like i said, pathetic.]
but you went on far too long about her body, it was just silly.
.
woah! Zenitram. I didn't know if that connected sentences played a role in how offensive something was? So if Hitler shrunk Mein Kampf to a single sentence that would be alright with you? But paragraphs are evil huh?

This whole thing comes down to one thing, bigotry. You guys are prejudice against guys who admire boobs. I feel like I'm rosa parks and being asked to move to the back of the bus because of my admiration for the female form. But I think I'd rather teach a civics lesson and defend my civil rights. I have gay friends and have defended their rights to say whatever and do whatever they want without fear of persecution and I don't see why I have to feel the same sort of heat just cause I'm hetero about it.

and here's a definition of SEXIST and SEXISM from DICTIONARY.com:

The belief that one sex (usually the male) is naturally superior to the other and should dominate most important areas of political, economic, and social life. Sexist discrimination in the United States in the past has denied opportunities to women in many spheres of activity. Many allege that it still does.

obviously I do not think Jenny is inferior so here is the killer:

Sexism against women is often called chauvinism, though chauvinism is actually a wider term for any extreme and unreasoning partisanship on behalf of a group to which one belongs, especially when the partisanship includes malice and hatred towards a rival group. Therefore many forms of radical feminism can legitimately be referred to as "chauvinism." This is not common usage, however, and the term is most often used to refer to male chauvinism.

While the view that women are superior to men is also sexism, only in recent years has an awareness of this "reverse sexism" begun to develop in public discourse.
How you like them apples? Unreasoning Partisanship right? and don't try to say it's misogyny cause that's a hatred of women.
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Kacy
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PostPosted: Sun Sep 18, 2005 11:45 am
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Well said zenitram and Grimlock. I hate how whenever a pic of Jenny is posted someone has to bring up the fact that she has big boobs. Get over it.
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Grimlock
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PostPosted: Sun Sep 18, 2005 11:46 am
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Kyle O'Riley wrote:
Whatever the rights and wrongs of individual points of view, from the outside looking in, I have to say that this has been a genuinely fascinating debate.

Just one point though; if you think the American War of Independence had anything to do with the emancipation of women or any other form of sexual freedom then you have a pretty warped view of history. Like all wars it was about power, autonomy and, most importantly, money (well taxes anyway). Quite rightly too I must add. Well done there the USA.
The war was about a lot of things. Yes, mostly cause you guys were assholes about the tax thing Laughing but also cause of religious and sex and whatever persecution caused people to live on a boat for months and risk dying to come to some weird land they didn't know about. So the war actually symbolized the need for freedom and independence even though it actually was just about whatever you said.
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